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JUSTICE1st
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 715
Location: USA
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 Posted: Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| SaberGal wrote: | | JUSTICE1st wrote: | | Truth Seeker wrote: | | LOL! I don't know who that is. I haven't researched other cases too much. I've been busy fighting for Raye Dawn. |
Sorry, TS, I should have explained.  Bill Peterson is the prosecutor in Ada, OK, who put Dennis Fritz and Ron Williamson in prison for a murder they NEVER committed. Then he put up a bit of a fight at first against having their DNA tested when the science was greatly improved.
According to John Grisham's THE INNOCENT MAN, the only reason Peterson approved the tests was to "nail Williamson and Fritz once and for all." He was astonished, and I believe furious, when the DNA test results came back, excluding BOTH Ron and Dennis as the murderers of Debbie Carter in 1982. Turned out the real murderer was Glen Gore, whom the Ada police had right under their noses, but failed to thoroughly investigate him.
From what I understand, Peterson is now suing Dennis Fritz, John Grisham, and a couple of other people for "emotional distress," or some such nonsense. I hope that ridiculous lawsuit doesn't even make it into court.
J  |
OK - Peterson, the DA that put Dennis Fritz in jail is now suing Dennis Fritz? Just when I thought I had heard it all..... |
I couldn't believe it when I heard that either! But as far as I know, the suit is still pending. I guess Peterson didn't like the well-deserved lambasting he got in Dennis Fritz's book JOURNEY TOWARD JUSTICE. Well, too bad! Maybe Peterson should have made sure, through the Ada PD, that they had the RIGHT person (Glen Gore) the first time, instead of the two men Peterson disliked the most. And who turned out to be the WRONG people. I hope Peterson's case gets tossed out of court!
J
_________________
"We must remember, always, that accusation is not proof, and conviction depends on evidence and due process of law."
EDWARD R. MURROW, 1954 |
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Nicks momom
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 11:19 am Post subject: |
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J1, To answer a previous question bout KBs hatred for RD. These are RDs words.
My first thought is to tell you to ask KB herself but you will not get an honest answer. My thoughts are that my marriage to LB wasnt what KB expected. We were young and wanted to do things our way. KB was used to her daughters doing exactly what she wanted them to do. She has a need for control and she could NEVER control me. I believe it spilled over to Kelseys visits. KB had all of her grandchildren at her beck and call at all times accept Kelsey. Her daughters all have custody of their children, but LB is the only boy and I had custody of Kelsey. I believe LBs marriage to Ashley was in trouble and KB was trying to use Kelsey to keep them together. I believe my relationship with Kelsey, my mother, my grandmother, and my sisters is closer than any relationship KB has with her daughters and she was jealous of that. I mean who in there right mind tells their daughter that they are so ugly thats why she doesnt take them any where? Plus I divorced her son, turned him into the police for abuse and Mrs Briggs was not happy about that. Point blank I think its jealousy, and an unhappiness that was there since she was a child. Knowing them before I dated LB I had NO idea that their family could be so mean, but I would go through it all over 100 million times if I could just have Kelsey back.
I didnt lay down and let her control me or step all over me when I was married to LB, when it came to Kelsey, during my case and the trial, I refuse to do it now. Its not pride its standing up for Kelsey, myself and for whats right. Raye Dawn Smith,
Kelsey and Blaines mommy
_________________
I expect to pass through this world but once.
Any good, therefore, that I can do, or any kindness that I can show to any human being, let me do it now.
Let me not defer or neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again.
- Stephen Krebbet, 1793-1855 |
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JUSTICE1st
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 715
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Nicks momom wrote: | J1, To answer a previous question bout KBs hatred for RD. These are RDs words.
My first thought is to tell you to ask KB herself but you will not get an honest answer. My thoughts are that my marriage to LB wasnt what KB expected. We were young and wanted to do things our way. KB was used to her daughters doing exactly what she wanted them to do. She has a need for control and she could NEVER control me. I believe it spilled over to Kelseys visits. KB had all of her grandchildren at her beck and call at all times accept Kelsey. Her daughters all have custody of their children, but LB is the only boy and I had custody of Kelsey. I believe LBs marriage to Ashley was in trouble and KB was trying to use Kelsey to keep them together. I believe my relationship with Kelsey, my mother, my grandmother, and my sisters is closer than any relationship KB has with her daughters and she was jealous of that. I mean who in there right mind tells their daughter that they are so ugly thats why she doesnt take them any where? Plus I divorced her son, turned him into the police for abuse and Mrs Briggs was not happy about that. Point blank I think its jealousy, and an unhappiness that was there since she was a child. Knowing them before I dated LB I had NO idea that their family could be so mean, but I would go through it all over 100 million times if I could just have Kelsey back.
I didnt lay down and let her control me or step all over me when I was married to LB, when it came to Kelsey, during my case and the trial, I refuse to do it now. Its not pride its standing up for Kelsey, myself and for whats right. Raye Dawn Smith,
Kelsey and Blaines mommy |
I strongly suspected it was a control issue with KB, and I appreciate RD letting us know exactly what the situation was.
People like KB are very good at putting up masks to deceive others into believing they are "nice" people, and hiding their uglier feelings underneath. Even those who knew them for a long time wouldn't know about the ugly side, unless they were personally exposed to it. Abusers do that all the time, putting on a "nice guy/gal" face to the world, and only abuse spouses or children when no one is around to witness it. Because they never abuse in front of others, they are still perceived as the "nice" person, and no one (other than the abused spouse/child) believes they're capable of such behavior. Well, why would they, since they didn't SEE it happen.
To me, KB comes across as an abuser, with a different kind of twist. She's fine with anyone who agrees with everything she says and does everything she tells them to do. She is NOT accepting or tolerant of anyone who challenges or disagrees with her, and she has demonstrated that repeatedly. Those who don't go along with KB are subjected to her irrational hatred, and her endless lies and threats. That is typical of an abuser too.
I have no doubt RD would go through it all over again if she could have her beautiful little daughter Kelsey back. I only wish that was possible.
J
_________________
"We must remember, always, that accusation is not proof, and conviction depends on evidence and due process of law."
EDWARD R. MURROW, 1954 |
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Nicks momom
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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I completely agree J1, when I first read about this case I wrote to RD, I really just wanted to give her some positive, comforting words and let her know I believed her basically. I was stunned when I got the first letter back from her. She is soooo young. She niave, gullible, sweet, and stubborn when it comes to the truth. She said I wouldnt have taken a plea deal of 27 minutes. I never hurt Kelsey or allowed MP to! She said KB KNOWS this.
It allways bothered me that she was 3 months pregnant with MPs baby when he killed Kelsey. She should be out raising her son and struggling through life like the rest of us.
_________________
I expect to pass through this world but once.
Any good, therefore, that I can do, or any kindness that I can show to any human being, let me do it now.
Let me not defer or neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again.
- Stephen Krebbet, 1793-1855 |
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JUSTICE1st
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 715
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 01, 2008 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Nicks momom wrote: | I completely agree J1, when I first read about this case I wrote to RD, I really just wanted to give her some positive, comforting words and let her know I believed her basically. I was stunned when I got the first letter back from her. She is soooo young. She niave, gullible, sweet, and stubborn when it comes to the truth. She said I wouldnt have taken a plea deal of 27 minutes. I never hurt Kelsey or allowed MP to! She said KB KNOWS this.
It allways bothered me that she was 3 months pregnant with MPs baby when he killed Kelsey. She should be out raising her son and struggling through life like the rest of us. |
Well, it bugs the heck out of me too, and to me, this whole case against Raye was driven by her ex MIL's spite and vindictiveness, like all other false allegations of "child abuse" cases, that so often happens in family situations where a separation, divorce or a custody battle is going on.
RD's case is very different in one way; a terrible crime DID happen, but Raye personally was in NO way directly responsible for that happening, no matter how many times KB and her fan club rant on that she was.
Of course, KB has to keep adding "fuel to the fire" to keep it going. She knows if that fire against Raye burns out, then the focus is going to shift over to HER and her actions and more people will begin to ask her some very hard questions. Such as; why did KB keep her OWN unflattering parenting record with DHS in 1979 such a secret? Why did she give up her own kids for two years, and what did she say at the time she gave them up?
Any investigator or attorney who regularly defends false allegations cases knows one thing: when liars are publicly exposed as frauds, their credibility is destroyed. The difficulty is finding that one damaging fact or set of facts that destroys that liar's credibility in court. But the lie (the false allegation itself) and the liar MUST be exposed, by a very careful, well-prepared and thorough cross-examination by the defense attorney, or the case is lost. It looks to me that this is exactly what happened here; people were literally afraid of KB, and were unwilling to take her on. That's why Raye was wrongfully convicted.
To paraphrase Clarence Darrow, the biggest bullies are also the biggest cowards. To use an old analogy, the bully in the school yard may be able to successfully beat up one or two of his challengers. But he cannot beat up a whole group of challengers at once. Sooner or later, one of those challengers will land the right punch, and other blows will follow. The bully will only be able to fight off so many before he finally goes down.
See where I'm going? KB may be able to intimidate or threaten one, two or even three people at a time, when she is challenged verbally with a hard question she doesn't want to answer. But she can't refuse to answer the same questions from a large majority in the town, not without looking like she obviously has one or two dark secrets to hide.
You and TS have mentioned that she's already ducking and refusing to answer certain questions, the ones that show KB in a far less flattering light. Just keep up the pressure, and publicly note the questions she consistently refuses to answer, and how many times she has refused to answer them. Eventually, THIS bully will go down too. 
J
_________________
"We must remember, always, that accusation is not proof, and conviction depends on evidence and due process of law."
EDWARD R. MURROW, 1954 |
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Nicks momom
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu May 08, 2008 10:48 am Post subject: |
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I have a question,
Justice 1 wrote,
"In fact, he [the real murderer] was a prime example of the problems caused by the prosecution complex, a mind-set that spurs some prosecutors, police officers, and judges across the country to pursue convictions at all costs in high-profile cases while settling for routine treatment of lesser crimes that don't generate publicity. The complex -- in which public relations and concerns about political ramifications can sway decision making, perhaps unconsciously -- is most noticeable when an angry community is demanding justice. In those cases, it can lead juries to demand less evidence to convict unpopular defendants than they would normally require. It can make authorities believe it is their duty to win a conviction. They begin to see the defendant and the criminal justice system's burdensome proprieties as foes that must be outwitted.
What can be done? Who do you write to? Why arent the DAs held accountable? Has there ever been a case against a prosecuter?
_________________
I expect to pass through this world but once.
Any good, therefore, that I can do, or any kindness that I can show to any human being, let me do it now.
Let me not defer or neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again.
- Stephen Krebbet, 1793-1855 |
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JUSTICE1st
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 715
Location: USA
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| Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| Nicks momom wrote: | I have a question,
Justice 1 wrote,
"In fact, he [the real murderer] was a prime example of the problems caused by the prosecution complex, a mind-set that spurs some prosecutors, police officers, and judges across the country to pursue convictions at all costs in high-profile cases while settling for routine treatment of lesser crimes that don't generate publicity. The complex -- in which public relations and concerns about political ramifications can sway decision making, perhaps unconsciously -- is most noticeable when an angry community is demanding justice. In those cases, it can lead juries to demand less evidence to convict unpopular defendants than they would normally require. It can make authorities believe it is their duty to win a conviction. They begin to see the defendant and the criminal justice system's burdensome proprieties as foes that must be outwitted.
What can be done? Who do you write to? Why arent the DAs held accountable? Has there ever been a case against a prosecuter? |
To answer your last question directly, there was a case against a prosecutor not too long ago. That was Mike Nifong, who had originally been in charge of prosecuting the Duke Lacrosse Players case in Durham, North Carolina.
I don't know if you're familiar with that case, and I can't go into the details right now, I may have to log off soon due to a thunderstorm in my area. It took a long time, but Nifong was finally publicly exposed as a "rogue prosecutor" and this was due to the efforts of highly dedicated defense attorneys who fought the good fight for their falsely accused clients.
Nifong was eventually disbarred, and was also found guilty of Criminal Contempt and served one day in the local jail. Not NEARLY enough, as far as I was concerned (should have been 6 months to 1 year), but it WAS something, even if only a slap on the wrist. And he still can no longer practice law, which is even better.
J
_________________
"We must remember, always, that accusation is not proof, and conviction depends on evidence and due process of law."
EDWARD R. MURROW, 1954 |
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Nicks momom
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 11:45 am Post subject: |
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Thanks you J1, I did read up on this case. Its doesnt seem right that its rare a DA is held accountable.
_________________
I expect to pass through this world but once.
Any good, therefore, that I can do, or any kindness that I can show to any human being, let me do it now.
Let me not defer or neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again.
- Stephen Krebbet, 1793-1855 |
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JUSTICE1st
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 715
Location: USA
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| Posted: Wed May 28, 2008 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Nicks momom wrote: | | Thanks you J1, I did read up on this case. Its doesnt seem right that its rare a DA is held accountable. |
It ISN'T right, and some people are still trying to push for laws against prosecutorial, judicial and police misconduct. They are definitely needed, because without such laws, the acts of misconduct will only get worse.
Prosecutors and judges WILL stop and seriously think about whether it's worth going to prison themselves if such laws were in place to punish acts of misconduct. But the laws have to be passed first. I'm not saying that these proposed laws, or even one law covering ALL officials (police, prosecutors and judges) have to have extreme prison sentences. But considering that the sentences THEY have imposed on the wrongfully convicted have been draconian or extreme, I'd say a minimum sentence of six months and a maximum of 2 years is being rather generous.
J
_________________
"We must remember, always, that accusation is not proof, and conviction depends on evidence and due process of law."
EDWARD R. MURROW, 1954 |
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